Elderberry Tincture/Syrup – make your own

[sstolzenburgStudent]

I recently went looking in the supplement aisle of my favorite discount store, (you can guess) and was pleased to find that they had elderberry syrup on the shelf……until I read the label. The syrup cost $ 9.96 for about 3 oz, and I thought well, elderberry is a potent remedy, so if it is good stuff, then maybe it is worth it. Then I looked at the ingredients. and noticed that blackberries were included, I assume for flavor. Then I read that the concentration was 1/64 th Elderberry! Come on! Ten bucks for 1/64th elderberry? I make my tinctures at 1/5 to 1/3, and I am not just using berries, I am using flowers too.

I think the public is being fooled when they go to the store and buy herbal preparations.

My elderberry syrup uses 4 oz of elderberries, in about 1 1/2 cups of syrup, made with honey, and other spices for flavor.

My tincture has real berries, and real flowers, and I mix it with juice AFTER I dispense it from the bottle…… and I get about pint of tincture made with glycerin for about 15.00. So I figure that considering the potency of my medicine versus the junk sold by WallyWorld, I am getting a better product for better than 1/10th the price.

I agree with Doc Jones…. Make your own and know what’s in it.

The Syrup you can learn to make from Learningherbs.com, and the tincture, well, there are plenty of sources out there for learning to make tincture…..and in terms of glycerin, you can get Food Grade, Kosher, vegetable glycerin on Amazon for 40.00 a gallon, and it is good stuff and the shipping is paid. Buy the ingredients and make your own…

Steve

[IdahoHerbalist]

This is exactly why Patrick stared his forum and school.

[Dr. Patrick JonesHomestead Instructor]

1/64th elderberry is pretty good compared to the 1/3 of herbal supplements that contain none of the herb on the label.

Doc

Don't use herbs or combine herbs with medications or use them during lactation or pregnancy without talking with your healthcare provider.

[sstolzenburgStudentTopic Author]

I found a 2:1 Elderberry glycerin tincture at Sprouts farmers market for 11.50, but it is only one oz. In a pinch OK, but still better if is your own.

Steve

[IdahoHerbalist]

Almost ALWAYS better to make your own, with materials that you collected or grew yourself.

[sstolzenburgStudentTopic Author]

So, I have made my own, but I am struggling a bit with the concentration of herbs to liquid. When i measure out elderberries, I am measuring a heavy dense berries, but the flowers are light weight and fluffy, and when I am trying t establish a herbs to liquid concentration, i am a bit unsure of the actual strength of the medicine. Should I consider the bulk herb ratio by weight or volume? If I weigh the berries, they are heavy, if I weigh the flowers they are very light. so that doesn’t seem to work?? It would seem to be more reasonable to measure say a 1/2 cup by volume….and use an equivalent mixture by volume not weight. Is my thinking correct? What would be an equivalent adult dose for a given liquid to herb ratio? or does it matter? I mean, I am not worried too much about overdose, but more about whether I am getting enough medicine . I think you have said a tablespoon for an adult 3-4 times a day, but that depends upon the strength. I am not that hung up about this but i would like a little coaching. I am always mixing flowers with berries.

Also, I am buying dried berries from San Francisco Herb Company because i can go to the store and buy it, no shipping, and it is somewhat local. I don’t have an elder tree and the berries and flowers are a reasonable price.

Steve

[IdahoHerbalist]

Steve,

With all home made medicine you will need to experiment on dose. We just don’t have the ways to test for that.

[sstolzenburgStudentTopic Author]

So I am on track. Then I will just keep doing it the same until experience tells me otherwise. 🙂

Steve

[sstolzenburgStudentTopic Author]

Doc, Steven,

I have one last question, I have been making my tincture without cooking the berries or flowers first. I have about 1.5 pints of 2:1 tincture, with 50% glycerin. Is it advisable to heat my tincture after I have made it, or should I just throw it out and start over? I am using a double boiler to heat it, but I don’t know if that is even necessary. I do not want to destroy the antioxident effect, just reduce the cyanide. i want al of the medicine, and I am not too worried about the cyanide since this is my second batch, It has not killed me yet.

Some of my sources say to cook it, some don’t say anything about it. They just put the berries in the bottle and make their tincture. I am using 1 part dried berries, 2 parts dried flowers and six parts (by volume) of 50% glycerin and distilled water.

Steve

[IdahoHerbalist]

First I have heard about cyanide in elder. Choke cherry, yes, but not this. Will have to look into that.

We do not cook wild cherry bark when preparing that and I would guess elder is less concentrated, but not certain.

Somethig else to learn! :yahoo:

[sstolzenburgStudentTopic Author]

Actually that was 4 parts glycerin water, in other words 2 cups of elderberries/flowers, 2 cups of glycerin, and two cups of distilled water for a 2:1 tincture. 🙄

In terms of the cyanide, many sources say to cook it, but the toxicity is only a problem in terms of it’s tendency to induce vomiting, which has never happened to me. The Elder leaves are supposed to be more toxic, and even the red berries are reportedly used by some Chinese, but they cook the berries and use with apparent impunity. The book by Stephen Harrod Buhner called Herbal AntiVirals has a pretty good section on it. I have also read that the Anthrocyanins are actually the most desirable in terms of phytochemical medicinal activity. Not sure the heating interferes with the concentration of anthrocyanins (spelling??). They are beneficial because they do not break down in the body so they are great for digestive/urinary tract infections. They also apparently have significant free radical activity. :yahoo:

I heated my tincture in a double boiler for a half hour, and maybe that did something, but I have no way of telling. :confused:

Steve

[IdahoHerbalist]

Heating, without replacing liquid, will ALWAYS concentrate those properties that are not removed by the steam.

This was emphasized in the recent bacteria bloom that happened in the midwest. 500,000 people were without water and they were specifically warned to not even try boiling their water for this reason.

[Laura L. BergesonStudent]

My elderberry extract is made with vodka and the dry elderberries and not heated. Stephen Buhner in his book “Herbal Antivirals” has a lot to say about using raw elderberries. In some individuals it can cause nausea and vomiting, but not death. We have been taking it daily as a herbal prophylactic for over a year and are fine. :crazy: I like the idea of using the elder flowers. Just today I picked a half bushel of elder leaves. Other than drying them to use in an infusion, any suggestions on what to do with them?

[IdahoHerbalist]

Elder leaf is actually the best medicine on the plant.

Leaf

Berry

Flower

in that order. The flower being recommended for children.

[Dr. Patrick JonesHomestead Instructor]

I don’t think the cyanide is an issue unless you use the bark or roots (which you should not).

Leaves may be a bit strong for little kids but I’ve never heard anything negative about the berries or flowers except with the berries of the Red Elder (Sambuccus racemosa) which are toxic enough to give you a bellyache.

Doc

Don't use herbs or combine herbs with medications or use them during lactation or pregnancy without talking with your healthcare provider.

[AnnettStudent]

sstolzenburg:

“My elderberry syrup uses 4 oz of elderberries, in about 1 1/2 cups of syrup, made with honey, and other spices for flavor.”

Does your recipe require heating?

Do you mind sharing your full recipe? I need anything to make my elder syrup taste good so my daughter will use it:)

Thanks so much for your help!

[Martha StanleyStudent]

A friend posted a recipe for making elderberry syrup using dried elderberries and an instapot pressure cooker.

I about croaked.

The recipe called for pressure cooking the berries, water, ginger, etc., for TEN minutes. :scared:

I kept thinking, heat is the enemy, heat is the enemy.

I imagine the taste will be lovely.

But…..

My question is about the medicinal value after being under pressure for 10 minutes. Sounds bad.

Am I off here?

Thanks.

Here’s the link. The recipe is waaaaay down at the end.

[IdahoHerbalist]

I am not sure what the thing is about elder berry syrup. Take the tincture and be done with it.

Heat IS the enemy.

[Martha StanleyStudent]

So….

Will the medicinal benefits be lessened due to the pressure cooking, more than when I simmer my dried berries for a nice, medicinal tea?

My friend said they did the syrup like this last winter and were thrilled with the results – 4 Family members, no sickness.

[IdahoHerbalist]

I will qualify my statement by saying that heat is the enemy to a LOT of nutritional and medicinal properties, but not all. It is always best to keep the heat as low as possible and for as short a time as possible. Pressure cooking SUPER heats things.

I am glad no one got sick but maybe they were not exposed or were exposed to something they had immunity built up for? Hard to say or qualify that one.

UPDATE: in another discussion on a different forum Patrick says that the medicinal properties of Elder are fairly heat tolerant. I still stand by my comment that the LESS heat you apply the better.

[Dr. Patrick JonesHomestead Instructor]

Marthabees wrote: So….

Will the medicinal benefits be lessened due to the pressure cooking, more than when I simmer my dried berries for a nice, medicinal tea?

My friend said they did the syrup like this last winter and were thrilled with the results – 4 Family members, no sickness.

Some herbalists I know use pressure cookers when making glycerites. I just don’t know what that sort of heat and pressure would do to the various medicinal properties of the various plants. I’d be pretty leary of pressure cooking anything medicinal.

Many people that didn’t take any of your friend’s syrup also didn’t get sick last winter. Maybe the syrup was terrific. I don’t know. Post hoc ergo propter hoc* is a fallacy we need to be careful with when judging results.

* After this, therefore because of this.

Don't use herbs or combine herbs with medications or use them during lactation or pregnancy without talking with your healthcare provider.

[Martha StanleyStudent]

Thank you all for the discussion about pressure cooking elderberries. I am remaining skeptical of using a pressure cooker on anything medicinal.

I will pass on this information to my friend who can use it as she wishes.

Martha

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